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7-Plus-NGM Digest May 2005

Date: Sun, 1 May 2005 16:44:06 +0200
From: "josef wagner"

Subject: Re: Re: safeties

hallo ken
i am not sure whether i have already written my suggestions to this problems overcoming with staggered pressure settings of the blow off valves.
one more:
- can you make a reducer into the inlet nozzle, like an orifice or a simple delavalle nozzle. this would help reducing the flow rate.
the minimum orifice area should not be less than the opening area of the seat of the blow off or safety valves so that supersonic velocity would only occure at the seat only (hypercritical pressure drop!)
best regards
from vienna, austria
josef wagner

Date: Sun, 01 May 2005 22:36:39 -0000
From: "jcborshard"

Subject: sourcing track spikes [not screws]

Hello, group!
Because the hobby has changed from using spikes to using screws to secure rail to ties, I've not been able to find a source for miniature spikes appropriate for 1/2" tall rail [1" scale] on rigid sections of portable track.
This rail is already fixed to the ties with adhesive, so the spikes are only for appearance.
Suggestions, anyone?

Date: Wed, 04 May 2005 01:54:57 -0000
From: "mamilbourne"

Subject: 3-3/4" scale 2-4-2 on Ebay

Item 5972850354.

This gorgeous steamer was built by someone I know.
The builder is a true craftsman. Everything on the loco is meticulously done and first class. He was kind enough to invite me to run it and it runs as nicely as it looks.


Date: Thu, 05 May 2005 14:51:58 +0000
From: "Roy Stevens"

Subject: RE: 3-3/4" scale 2-4-2 on Ebay

Yes, I'd purchase it right away, but I need to find my disposable income, it seems to have eluded me at the moment.
I'd have to sell about 200 of my Thomas conversions to finance that.
*shameless plug*

Roy (with tounge firmly in cheek)

Date: Fri, 06 May 2005 17:08:33 -0700
From: Trevor Heath

Subject: Search for Robert B Cummings

Can anyone help?


-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 6:39 PM
From: Fred Denton [mailto:gnsteam@earthlink.net]
To: trevor@livesteaming.com
Subject: Search for Robert B Cummings

Greeting Trevor,

Love your web site! I visit it frequently. I was hoping you could help with my search for a Mr. Robert B. Cummings. Robert published in the late nineties a publication, Scale Steam Pictorial. I recently discovered a copy of this publication at a friends home. As I thumb through the pages I was surprised to fine a feature article on a locomotive that I now own. October of 2003 at the St Croix Railroad in Hudson WI, I purchased Richard (Dick) Johnson's 1" scale O-8 Mikado. As you can imagine I was very surprise and excited to find an article about Dick and his beautiful locomotive. So I'm trying to locate and get in touch with Mr. Cummings, in hopes that he may have any back issues available.

So far my search has come up dry. The only address I have to work with is Scale Steam Pictorial, P.O. Box 400036 Hesperia, CA 92345. A short paragraph from the editor mentioned his home club of the Riverside Live Steamers. I have been to their web site and sent emails to their contact addresses with no replies. So I was hoping maybe you might have met or have any information about Mr. Cummings. I appreciate any help you can provide.

Thank you in advance,
Fred Denton
Lincoln, NE

Date: Sat, 07 May 2005 21:10:38 +1200
From: Grant & Donna Alexander

Subject: Re: Re: safeties

Josef, are you suggesting to actually restrict the flow of steam into the safety? What about restricting the outlet from the safety to allow a bit of back pressure within the safety to help re-seat it?


Date: Sat, 07 May 2005 21:24:54 +1200
From: Grant & Donna Alexander

Subject: Re: Re: safeties

Chuck, are you suggesting much the same as Josef, to restrict the steam flow INTO the safety?


Date: Sun, 08 May 2005 01:43:29 -0000
From: "chevwilliam"

Subject: Re: safeties

Dear Mr. Alexander,
Based upon imperfect knowledge of the actual safeties in use, I believe that restricting the outlet from the safety would Increase the blowdown, not decrease it.
As you mentioned you can 'hit' the stem o f the spring guide and cause it to reseat, this means to me that this stem would project through the top of the safety and act like a piston in a bore if the internals of the safety are pressurized by a restricted steam outlet.
I would suggest that if you are willing to experiment on one of the safeties, to carefully open the steam outlet port(s) to increazse the venting outlet area and alos insure that the internal passaages past the lifted ball and spring guide are at least the same area as the outlet(s). Note also that the ball and lower end of the spring guide should be 'guided' to prevent 'cocking' o fthem and thereby resulting in a 'hanging' ball and/or spring guide in the open position. I believe that the area of a conical furstrum between the seat and the ball should be equal to, or slightly larger than, the area of the circle defined by the seat diameter. Areas toward the outlet from that plane should increase in size to assure venting of the waste steam smoothly with a minimum internal pressure drop due to flow.
I hope this is of use.
Best Regards,
William J. Stewart.

Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 19:24:10 +1200
From: Grant & Donna Alexander

Subject: Re: Re: safeties

Well, good news. The safety valves on my little loco are working great again, seems that Chuck and Josef were right on the money, and restricting the steam flow into the lower pressure safety has given it a nice differential of around 4PSI.

Thanks very much guys!!

Grant & Donna Alexander
Squirrel Valley
Cambridge, NZ.

Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 21:47:30 -0000
From: "srcl_24"

Subject: Photos SRCL Ry again

Hello again, Well, we were at it again with steam. Probably best day yet on the Sandy Ridge without snow to plow.

My second link did't work but i fixed it if u want to go back and try again. Some more to follow.

SRCL Ry #7 at Clear Lake with train & Duncan.
extra 7 west ready to leave

SRCL Ry #7,#10,CLL#4 at Phelps
#7 with Tom Casper,#10 with Mike Allen,#4

Tom C.

Date: Wed, 11 May 2005 01:34:53 -0000
From: "mikell48744"

Subject: Links

I'm reworking my links page to add railroads and suppliers by scale.
If you would like to be added just drop me a line from my links page with your link and a short description.



Date: Wed, 11 May 2005 19:10:15 +1200
From: Grant & Donna Alexander

Subject: Re: safeties

Thanks William, we have tried already opening out the passages and exhaust side of the safety valve, this didn't make any difference. Also, regarding "cocking" of the ball once open, the same excessive differential occurred in a brand new safety, and this safety valve has since been tested on another boiler, and found to have a 7 PSI differential. Am still waiting on it's return following these tests to confirm that it still has a 30 PSI differential in my boiler, but, as I seem to have a workable solution this won't get tested for a while.

Regarding the safety issue, I have not altered my second (higher pressure) safety valve, so still have a good margin of safety for the accumulation test we perform from time to time on the loco.

Grant Alexander
Squirrel Valley,
Cambridge, New Zealand.

Date: Wed, 11 May 2005 19:15:19 +1200
From: Grant & Donna Alexander

Subject: Re: Re: safeties

This is a link to a picture of the loco in question. This is off my good friend Chris' website..

Grant Alexander
Squirrel Valley,
Cambridge, New Zealand.

Date: Fri, 13 May 2005 11:07:07 -0400
From: "russ@hobby-tronics.com"

Subject: Over The Hill Livesteamers Train Meet

Hi gang,

Just a friendly reminder of the upcoming Train Meet, May 28th and 29th, Over The Hill Livesteamers, Chiloquin, Oregon. Check the website for details and registration stuff. Remember we are right next door to Train Mountain and look forward to see you there.


Russ Wood
President, OTH
Chiloquin, Or.

Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 07:51:49 -0500
From: "Bill Laird"

Subject: There's a new NG locomotive in Texas

After 3 1/2 years of on and off building, Texas Republic Railroad is very happy to announce that Number 7 steamed for the first time on Saturday, April 30. The locomotive trials were conducted at the Annetta Valley & Western RR near Ft. Worth, Texas. Number 7 is a scratch built narrow gauge steam locomotive loosely based on the design of an H. K. Porter Locomotive Class B-2-T, "Six Wheel Local Passenger Locomotive".

I have uploaded a few pictures in the Photos section under the folder TRR#7.

Extra #7 at AV&W RR

First Run Photo 1

First Run Photo 2

First Run Photo 3

First Run Photo 4

First Run Photo 5

TRR Number 7 is a 2 1/2" scale coal fired steam locomotive. Chassis, cylinders, valve gear, and boiler are from the MEG Steam Wendy design. Remainder of the locomotive is freelance, based mostly on pictures from the H. K. Porter catalog and several books showing photographs of Colorado narrow gauge locomotives. Tender tank is a Loco Parts kit mounted on a scratch built frame and arch bar trucks.

Bill Laird
Canyon Lake, Texas

Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 06:42:52 -0700
From: Peter Moseley

Subject: Re: There's a new NG locomotive in Texas

Congratulations Bill

We just steamed our 2.5"/foot scale model of D&RGW #278 for the first time on May 4th. I'll post some pictures to our website in the next week or so.

Peter Moseley

Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 13:05:24 -0400
From: mrjcad@netscape.net

Subject: Re: There's a new NG locomotive in Texas

Congrats to both of you, Bill and Peter. It is so nice to celebrate spring w/new rolling stock and be able to show and strut all summer and fall as well.

I've tride to do the same but all I got was 4 pieces started and not finished. MMmm, spring is here and it is time to work on trackage - car/loco building is inside winter work!!

Laurence Johnson,

Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 05:34:43 -0000
From: "Jeff Badger"

Subject: Re: There's a new NG locomotive in Texas

Bill, wonderful news. Good to see another bashed Meg running. Looks great too!

Jeff Badger

Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 05:43:11 -0000
From: "Jeff Badger"

Subject: New Spring things being built

Since Bill Laird and Peter Mosely have finished up some long term projects, I thought I would post a new one I have been working on.

2.5" scale steam powered fire train.

The tank car is based upon a Michigan California Lumber with a little freelancing from Colorado as you can see.

The fire pump is a 10" diameter vertical boiler I built. I is propane fired and sits on a donkey skid. A 1/2pint Detroit Lubricator feeds a Marsh Feedwater Pump. Hose & Hose Reel is from Harbor Freight. Ready to debut at Sacramento hopefully this weekend.

Jeff Badger
Soquel Pacific Coast RY.

Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 07:43:15 -0500
From: "Bill Laird"

Subject: Re: Re: There's a new NG locomotive in Texas

Thanks, Jeff.

Missed you this year at the Maricopa Spring Meet.


Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 07:48:06 -0500
From: "Bill Laird"

Subject: Re: New Spring things being built


Looks good! We always need more 2 1/2" scale rolling stock.

Bill Laird
Canyon Lake, Texas

Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 15:58:01 -0000
From: "Jeff Badger"

Subject: Caboose anyone?

I have a D&RGW shorty for sale complete with working handbrakes and a real coal burning potbelly stove!

Contact me for more if interested. See the pics posted in the photo section under caboose.


Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 17:16:26 -0000
From: "James D. Keeline"

Subject: LA Live Steamers Spring Meet

I know that the LA Live Steamers Spring Meet is Fri-Sun of Memorial Day weekend. However, their web site has precious little in details and my e-mail asking for info about the schedule has not been answered after nearly a week.

Does anyone in this group have additional information about this event? I don't have any equipment but don't know if I should just show up on Saturday. Knowing the times would be helpful, of course.

James in San Diego

Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 21:55:35 GMT
From: "btflco@juno.com"

Subject: Re: LA Live Steamers Spring Meet

James, knowing how the LALS operates, just show up! You will be welcomed as I have been when I go down with no equipment. If you get there by 9am lots will be happening I am sure.


Date: Sun, 22 May 2005 14:51:35 -0000
From: "srcl_24"

Subject: srcl ry pics

Hi, I uploaded to the files section 3 more photos from our may 7th operating session. I forgot to check off on add a link for one of them so check the files section for my folder. sandy ridge and clear lake ry, may 05.

Shay #4 leaving Phelps

#7 in siding waiting

#7 resting between runs

Tom C.

Date: Mon, 23 May 2005 15:23:36 -0600
From: "Mike Decker"

Subject: Re: srcl ry pics

Hi Tom:

Nice pictures.....I'm looking forward to my visit in June.

Mike Decker

Date: Mon, 23 May 2005 18:50:57 -0700
From: Trevor Heath

Subject: Build your own "Karamoja"

Thought you might like this.

You'll need Adobe to open it.



Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 06:10:17 -0000
From: "smallhand27"

Subject: RGS

Where can I find a dimensioned drawing/plan of one of the RGS "Galloping Goose"?

Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 12:33:18 +1200
From: "Chris Draper"

Subject: Fiji Loco's

Reading a great little book on Fiji sugar cane railways. There are some cute little NG prototypes here just begging to be modeled, which raised the question in my mind.

Does anyone know of any 7+ models of these little beauties?

How do they run?

Chris Draper
Winter Creek Bush Tramway
Auckland, New Zealand

Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 01:11:49 -0000
From: "mikell48744"

Subject: Coal

Looking for coal information for my site what you like and why and where you get yours


General Links Section under Coal

Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 09:29:43 -0400
From: "Bill & Nancy Eckert"

Subject: Re: Coal


Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 14:02:23 EDT
From: kennarwing@aol.com

Subject: Re:sugarcane locos

Not sure how broad your question is, but the Allen Models "Chloe" is based on what was originally a 24" gauge sugar cane loco. Quite a number have been built here in the states. I also saw a very nice looking one called Olomana that was clearly not based on the Chloe castings, but can't say anything more about it. Perhaps others with more experience can say how well they run.
Ken Wing

Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 16:16:40 -0400

From: "mikell"

Subject: Re: Coal

Thanks I add the link to my site.


Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 17:41:24 -0000
From: "fred veenschoten"

Subject: Re:sugarcane locos

i built a Chloe 10 years ago and run it about 6 to 8 times a year. it is a good running engine if you change a few things. the ones i've run that were built to the plans are a bit shy steamers but pull well.
fred v

Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 17:52:36 -0000
From: "John Haskey"

Subject: Re:sugarcane locos

I'd be interested in hearing about your changes to the 'Chloe'. I'm pondering a rework of mine and if I can make improvements along the way so be it.


Date: Fri, 27 May 2005 17:16:16 -0000
From: "fred veenschoten"

Subject: Re:sugarcane locos

the main one is to use 6" pipe for the boiler but if you already have one built you are stuck. the others are going to 1 1/4" pipe for the stack and increase the tube for the blower to 1/4". these things help get more gasses through. the blower is undersized and makes recovery slow. also play with the exhaust nozzle. you should be able to pop off going up a grade. if not then reduce the nozzle size a bit to increase the velocity up the stack.
i think these ideas would even help a 5" boiler if that's what you have.
good luck,
fred v